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	<title>Comments on: Next aisle over</title>
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	<link>http://chuckleaduck.com/comic/next-aisle-over/</link>
	<description>ChuckleADuck is a webcomic that examines atheism, religion, politics, and general silliness from its own unique perspective. Its audience includes atheists, evangelicals, the spiritual, the cynical, young, old, liberals, conservatives and the occasional space alien.</description>
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		<title>By: Somebody</title>
		<link>http://chuckleaduck.com/comic/next-aisle-over/comment-page-1/#comment-4899</link>
		<dc:creator>Somebody</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Feb 2013 05:55:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chuckleaduck.com/?p=1733#comment-4899</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Argh, the comments...I need to go bang my head against a wall now.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Argh, the comments&#8230;I need to go bang my head against a wall now.</p>
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		<title>By: Jadugara</title>
		<link>http://chuckleaduck.com/comic/next-aisle-over/comment-page-1/#comment-4323</link>
		<dc:creator>Jadugara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Dec 2012 07:43:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chuckleaduck.com/?p=1733#comment-4323</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[OK,...having done EXTENSIVE study on this topic, I can safely say the admin is correct...  Out of the DOZENS of reports I read concerning this, not a single one indicated that this find negated the assumed age of the fossils in any way...  It simply indicated that the processes governing how deeply the replacing mineralization event could penetrate into the actual bones of that size had been over-estimated...  The result?  Despite how long they had been in the earth, the fossilization was never able to reach the marrow in the thicker bones...  Essentially, the marrow was too deep within the larger bones for the fossilization process to reach...  Because of this, the marrow within simply became mummified; trapped in a veritable &quot;time capsule&quot; for millions of years...  

Based on all the data I have absorbed, there have been numerous other finds like this, now that the scientific community have dared to begin breaking many of these larger bones to see if this holds true.  It does...  In the past, every POSSIBLE care was taken never to break these larger bones when they were found... They&#039;re simply FAR too valuable whole and un-damaged (since most fossils are found pre-shattered)...  This is why the breaking of the T-Rex bone was such a big deal in the first place (due to the fact they had incredible difficulty getting it out of the remote location it was discovered in)...  It&#039;s super-rare to have one of the larger dinosaur fossil skeletons discovered with most of it&#039;s bones un-cracked,...and when they do find them completely whole and intact,...it&#039;s even RARER to break them considering how careful they are excavating and transporting them...  The T-Rex one got broken during a bad helicopter ride... 

Such finds, by the way, are VERY rare...  The events surrounding fossilization itself is rare enough that we have only discovered a very, very tiny fraction of all the types of life that have existed on Earth...  Conditions have to be super perfect for fossilization to even be a possibility in the first place,....which means there is a HUGE probability that there are thousands of &quot;missing links&quot; that are yet to be found,...and millions more that never even became fossils... 

Most folks who want to believe that the Earth is much younger, however, or want to believe that dinosaurs existed contemporaneously with man, seek to dismiss the information I have given above, merely because it would displease them...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK,&#8230;having done EXTENSIVE study on this topic, I can safely say the admin is correct&#8230;  Out of the DOZENS of reports I read concerning this, not a single one indicated that this find negated the assumed age of the fossils in any way&#8230;  It simply indicated that the processes governing how deeply the replacing mineralization event could penetrate into the actual bones of that size had been over-estimated&#8230;  The result?  Despite how long they had been in the earth, the fossilization was never able to reach the marrow in the thicker bones&#8230;  Essentially, the marrow was too deep within the larger bones for the fossilization process to reach&#8230;  Because of this, the marrow within simply became mummified; trapped in a veritable &#8220;time capsule&#8221; for millions of years&#8230;  </p>
<p>Based on all the data I have absorbed, there have been numerous other finds like this, now that the scientific community have dared to begin breaking many of these larger bones to see if this holds true.  It does&#8230;  In the past, every POSSIBLE care was taken never to break these larger bones when they were found&#8230; They&#8217;re simply FAR too valuable whole and un-damaged (since most fossils are found pre-shattered)&#8230;  This is why the breaking of the T-Rex bone was such a big deal in the first place (due to the fact they had incredible difficulty getting it out of the remote location it was discovered in)&#8230;  It&#8217;s super-rare to have one of the larger dinosaur fossil skeletons discovered with most of it&#8217;s bones un-cracked,&#8230;and when they do find them completely whole and intact,&#8230;it&#8217;s even RARER to break them considering how careful they are excavating and transporting them&#8230;  The T-Rex one got broken during a bad helicopter ride&#8230; </p>
<p>Such finds, by the way, are VERY rare&#8230;  The events surrounding fossilization itself is rare enough that we have only discovered a very, very tiny fraction of all the types of life that have existed on Earth&#8230;  Conditions have to be super perfect for fossilization to even be a possibility in the first place,&#8230;.which means there is a HUGE probability that there are thousands of &#8220;missing links&#8221; that are yet to be found,&#8230;and millions more that never even became fossils&#8230; </p>
<p>Most folks who want to believe that the Earth is much younger, however, or want to believe that dinosaurs existed contemporaneously with man, seek to dismiss the information I have given above, merely because it would displease them&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: MidnightDStroyer</title>
		<link>http://chuckleaduck.com/comic/next-aisle-over/comment-page-1/#comment-4084</link>
		<dc:creator>MidnightDStroyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2012 23:53:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chuckleaduck.com/?p=1733#comment-4084</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[One thing I&#039;ve noticed that hasn&#039;t been mentioned yet: As it concerns Geology, ~Time~ is the biggest enemy. It has a tendency to wipe out more evidence than the environmental conditions could preserve. Lack of evidence does not equate with evidence of lack. The only thing that really separates theory from fact is the accumulation of evidence. The whole concept of any scientific discipline is to seek &amp; find evidence to support a theory...Advancing technologies are designed to help us find more evidence.

I ascribe to a difference between Religion &amp; Organized Religion, in that any Organization created by Men operates more on the Politics of Power, whereas Religion itself is something like a study in Humanities Sciences (ie: The Nature of Man). In my readings of history, Organized Religion has harbored more out-right hatred of sciences than the other way around.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One thing I&#8217;ve noticed that hasn&#8217;t been mentioned yet: As it concerns Geology, ~Time~ is the biggest enemy. It has a tendency to wipe out more evidence than the environmental conditions could preserve. Lack of evidence does not equate with evidence of lack. The only thing that really separates theory from fact is the accumulation of evidence. The whole concept of any scientific discipline is to seek &amp; find evidence to support a theory&#8230;Advancing technologies are designed to help us find more evidence.</p>
<p>I ascribe to a difference between Religion &amp; Organized Religion, in that any Organization created by Men operates more on the Politics of Power, whereas Religion itself is something like a study in Humanities Sciences (ie: The Nature of Man). In my readings of history, Organized Religion has harbored more out-right hatred of sciences than the other way around.</p>
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		<title>By: Hilsh</title>
		<link>http://chuckleaduck.com/comic/next-aisle-over/comment-page-1/#comment-3739</link>
		<dc:creator>Hilsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Oct 2012 02:58:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://chuckleaduck.com/?p=1733#comment-3739</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s a wonder to me that you should mention Gould and yet have no idea of what the man&#039;s actual work says.  He was not a creationist who is known for espousing that there was no such thing as evolution.  In fact he is the father of the theory of punctuated equilibrium which states that there are relatively long static periods followed by period or rapid change.  This is not by any means an effort to say that evolution doesn&#039;t exist but that it is that the rate of change varies.  That doesn&#039;t even fly in the face of the original Origin of Species, small changes in environment over a short period would be expected to not create huge advantages for one adaptation over another.  The largest changes would be expected from very rapid environmental change over a short period in which a major percentage of species would die off in a short period of time.

Colin Patterson&#039;s quote is taken out of context.  His quote was specifically about a single book he had written in regard to a specific line of fossil fish.  He was asked about why no transitional fossils of this particular species was included in his particular book.  And his response that, &quot;There is not one such fossil for which one might make a watertight argument.&quot;  Was never intended to be an answer to another question other than the one he was asked which was &quot;In such a scholarly book as yours about this particular species why were there no transitional fossils included.&quot;  Patterson himself has been quoted many times that this was not a quote about the general case he was asked a specific question about a specific species.

BTW in regards to the T-Rex marrow at least one case was positively proven to be a laboratory contamination of fossil bone with the DNA of present day living thing.  The problem comes when you mine quotes out of data out of context and attempt to use them to prove something else completely.  The problem then becomes the data was never collected with that specific purpose in mind.  If you&#039;re not planning on testing a fossil for DNA then you don&#039;t take steps during collection to prevent DNA contamination.  And if you don&#039;t take those steps and then you use those samples in a completely different way you may get bad results.  This all comes out in the wash as careful checks are done after the fact to try and account for anomalies in data.  A formal paper only gets written up when the input data is controlled and repeatable.  That&#039;s why you don&#039;t see a journal like Science or Nature printing up some of these wild conclusions.  It&#039;s not that scientists are ignoring what they don&#039;t like it&#039;s that they are controlling variables to arrive at a supportable conclusion.  No controls, then they don&#039;t make the claims.  You might see someone saying &quot;we&#039;re looking into this and if it is true then it would be very exciting&quot;.  When you don&#039;t see anything else you don&#039;t need to go any further than &quot;guess it wasn&#039;t true or at least unsupportable&quot; no need to break out the tinfoil hats and disparage scientists for hiding evidence.

You can point the arrow either way you want.  But look up what the people you are quoting say their remarks mean.  What they are willing to stand behind.  If they don&#039;t come to the same point as you do based on their data then there&#039;s a pretty good chance you shouldn&#039;t be using them as part of your argument.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s a wonder to me that you should mention Gould and yet have no idea of what the man&#8217;s actual work says.  He was not a creationist who is known for espousing that there was no such thing as evolution.  In fact he is the father of the theory of punctuated equilibrium which states that there are relatively long static periods followed by period or rapid change.  This is not by any means an effort to say that evolution doesn&#8217;t exist but that it is that the rate of change varies.  That doesn&#8217;t even fly in the face of the original Origin of Species, small changes in environment over a short period would be expected to not create huge advantages for one adaptation over another.  The largest changes would be expected from very rapid environmental change over a short period in which a major percentage of species would die off in a short period of time.</p>
<p>Colin Patterson&#8217;s quote is taken out of context.  His quote was specifically about a single book he had written in regard to a specific line of fossil fish.  He was asked about why no transitional fossils of this particular species was included in his particular book.  And his response that, &#8220;There is not one such fossil for which one might make a watertight argument.&#8221;  Was never intended to be an answer to another question other than the one he was asked which was &#8220;In such a scholarly book as yours about this particular species why were there no transitional fossils included.&#8221;  Patterson himself has been quoted many times that this was not a quote about the general case he was asked a specific question about a specific species.</p>
<p>BTW in regards to the T-Rex marrow at least one case was positively proven to be a laboratory contamination of fossil bone with the DNA of present day living thing.  The problem comes when you mine quotes out of data out of context and attempt to use them to prove something else completely.  The problem then becomes the data was never collected with that specific purpose in mind.  If you&#8217;re not planning on testing a fossil for DNA then you don&#8217;t take steps during collection to prevent DNA contamination.  And if you don&#8217;t take those steps and then you use those samples in a completely different way you may get bad results.  This all comes out in the wash as careful checks are done after the fact to try and account for anomalies in data.  A formal paper only gets written up when the input data is controlled and repeatable.  That&#8217;s why you don&#8217;t see a journal like Science or Nature printing up some of these wild conclusions.  It&#8217;s not that scientists are ignoring what they don&#8217;t like it&#8217;s that they are controlling variables to arrive at a supportable conclusion.  No controls, then they don&#8217;t make the claims.  You might see someone saying &#8220;we&#8217;re looking into this and if it is true then it would be very exciting&#8221;.  When you don&#8217;t see anything else you don&#8217;t need to go any further than &#8220;guess it wasn&#8217;t true or at least unsupportable&#8221; no need to break out the tinfoil hats and disparage scientists for hiding evidence.</p>
<p>You can point the arrow either way you want.  But look up what the people you are quoting say their remarks mean.  What they are willing to stand behind.  If they don&#8217;t come to the same point as you do based on their data then there&#8217;s a pretty good chance you shouldn&#8217;t be using them as part of your argument.</p>
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